tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post3741185200652163295..comments2023-12-01T18:05:24.875-05:00Comments on Debunking Christianity: Christian, What Would You Believe if the Bible Didn't Exist?Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger268125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-17652625921283415452010-07-19T22:11:06.112-04:002010-07-19T22:11:06.112-04:00@Gandalf
Marcus you faithful idiot.Maybe your bib...@Gandalf<br /><br /><b>Marcus you faithful idiot.Maybe your bible tells us not to drink and drive either.</b><br /><br />Gandalf, the Bible does not cover drinking and driving but it does tell us to love our neighbors. Putting others in danger by drinking driving is clearly against such a teaching.<br /><br /><b>Your suggestion is the bible law is all we need.</b><br /><br />When did I say that? All I mean is that the Bible is easy to show that the Jim Jones was nuts. He didn't believe the Bible anymore than you do. You have more in common with him than I do. <br /><br /><b>Its really a waste of time talking to ignorant people of faith like you.</b><br /><br />Aw...I was enjoying laughing at your arguments.<br /><br /><b>So your bleat on about other ancient knowledge being lost etc ....Dont do anything to explain why with the Noah story more wasnt explained ...If this knowledge was known.<br /><br />See Marcus, so happens we have nothing written about where those batterys came.We have nothing written about how they built piramids.</b><br /><br />Gandalf, think about it. You said that it makes no sense to think that great technology can be lost. I countered your "argument" by pointing out that ancient and useful knowledge has been lost repeatedly. The battery is another great example as is Noah's Ark. We don't need to have anything written about the battery because one has actually been dug up and dated to the first century AD. Your argument is too pathetic to be funny.<br /><br />Someone knew enought to make a working battery 2000 years ago. So I guess they evolved. Or may be aliens did it...like the pyramids. Get real.<br /><br /><br /><b>You can call me what you like ....But i suggest you came here supposedly wanting to prove you could prove many folks here wrong.<br /><br />But personally i havent seen you prove f**k all .Maybe you managed to prove ! how somebody can be educated! and even have great grammer!, yet still be a real faithful ignorant tossa</b><br /><br />The only thing I have called you is ignorant, unwise, and silly. You continue to prove it with each argument you make. Thanks by the way. Also profanity seems to be your way of expression at best. Sad.<br /><br /><b><br />You managed to prove that people like you and Bush have these things in common ...L.o.L </b><br /><br />I'd rather have some things in common with George Bush than Jim Jones as you do.mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-32589224850561445502010-04-08T10:26:28.469-04:002010-04-08T10:26:28.469-04:00Well, that's kinda a weird question. By "...Well, that's kinda a weird question. By "The Bible", ya mean all the documents contained within. This wouldn't mean, however, that the events recorded by the documents didn't occur, or would be recorded by others.<br /><br />So it's kinda a weird question. But I think I kinda know what you're tryin' to ask, and I would answer: an interventionist Deist, or agnostic. Or maybe a Muslim (but I don't know how the Quran could exist if the Bible didn't).MWMhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03236289418712658119noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-54611512176043781302010-04-07T04:16:59.442-04:002010-04-07T04:16:59.442-04:00Marcus said...."Jonestown is not a good examp...Marcus said...."Jonestown is not a good example becaue they expressly and completley went against scripture and you will not find a person who agree with the doctrines and theology."<br /><br />Marcus you faithful idiot.Maybe your bible tells us not to drink and drive either.<br /><br />Are you such a f**king ignorant walley that you`d suggest we dont need any new drink-drive laws,because your f**king bible supposedly tells people not to crink and drive ?.<br /><br />Its really a waste of time talking to ignorant people of faith like you.<br /><br />Your faith makes you brain dead!.<br /><br />Your bible might also tell us not to commit abortion too ....So then ...why are people of faith seeking modern laws to govern these things ?.<br /><br />Your suggestion is the bible law is all we need.<br /><br />I will no longer discuss these matters with you Marcus.<br /><br />Like i said its become obvious its pointless.Your faith makes you brain dead.<br /><br />Marcus said...."Do you have any idea of how much ancient knowledge has been lost! Do you realize that we still don't really know how the great pyramids in Egypt were built? And then there's that working 2000 year-old battery in Iraq...we don't know who made it, what it was for...or why"<br /><br />So what? ....big f**king deal<br /><br />The difference is the bible writers have taken the time to explain much about Noah and the ark etc.<br /><br />So your bleat on about other ancient knowledge being lost etc ....Dont do anything to explain why with the Noah story more wasnt explained ...If this knowledge was known.<br /><br />See Marcus, so happens we have nothing written about where those batterys came.We have nothing written about how they built piramids.<br /><br />This is the big difference between these things and the Noah story.There is no good reason why such important things would not have been recorded also,except that they couldnt record what they never yet knew about.<br /><br />Marcus said....."You alos make a lot of assertions trying to poke holes in the design of the ark and just succeed in further embarassing yourself."<br /><br />Oh what ever! Marcus, i dont give a damn what you think about me,so happens i dont really think that much of you either ..Infact after you laid all blame on my faithful family,im inclined to think you are a right f**king ignorant arsehole!. and but yes i do happen to know how to find the volume of a box.But im finshed with this discussion with you ....<br /><br />You can call me what you like ....But i suggest you came here supposedly wanting to prove you could prove many folks here wrong.<br /><br />But personally i havent seen you prove f**k all .Maybe you managed to prove ! how somebody can be educated! and even have great grammer!, yet still be a real faithful ignorant tossa<br /><br />You managed to prove that people like you and Bush have these things in common ...L.o.LGandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-15118775317581234152010-04-07T03:43:48.344-04:002010-04-07T03:43:48.344-04:00Marcus..."What kind of action would satisfy y...Marcus..."What kind of action would satisfy you? What kind of crimes are you trying to prevent that we already don't have laws for?"<br /><br />Its so obvious we dont have laws to protect people against faith abuse.How else do you think these abusive faiths get to first form and continue Marcus?.<br /><br />We have regulation of Schooling,regulation of Health and hospital practices etc etc.We have people going around from time to time who investigate and audit all these other practices.Finding out if people are happy with the services,investigating any malpractice etc.<br /><br />But the practice of faiths gets free rein.....And for the existence of this double standard,some must pay the price<br /><br />Marcus said...."You called me ignorant but where have you been the past 8 years? Everyone who knows anything about the ex-president calls his intellect and education into question."<br /><br />But thats exactly my point Marcus.My point is you can have great grammer and a excellent education,yet still be F**king damn thick!<br /> <br />L.o.L<br /><br />Marcus said ..."The reason why there are crimes and stuff is because people are refusing to obey the commands and views given in scripture."<br /><br />Oh what ever .<br /><br />I suggest you just proved my point,education and grammer dont stop a person from still being f**king thick.<br /><br />You say the only problem is people want to be evil and disobey the bible.<br /><br />You are talking about my own family here.And you are bloody wrong Marcus....You are one ignorant fool!.<br /><br />I dont like the way my faithful family lived their faith.But still i will not stand by quietly! while ignorant f**ckers like you try to throw (all the blame) their way.And if we were face to face,by jove i`d sure still tell you straight out what i think of f**king ignorant thoughtless arsholes of faith like you.<br /><br />This will be my last reply to you on this subject.Stay ignorant if it pleases you.<br /><br />Im just glad many of the youth of today! are getting to see people like you ignorantly blaming the people for everything,about situations caused by a old mess of book known as the bible.<br /><br />It is the ignorance of people like Marcus,that will help slowly rid this earth of faith.<br /><br />You need to have faithfully brainless! to really believe all people in abusive faiths etc ,do so only because they personally wish to be evil etc.<br /><br />It happens because your bible the manual of life ....Gods word<br /><br />Is a utter mess and is honestly quite useless as any manual of life for all people to follow.Gandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-27087826328641775282010-04-05T16:26:03.071-04:002010-04-05T16:26:03.071-04:00Gandalf said
Marcus said......"Who says Noah...<b>Gandalf said</b><br /><br />Marcus said......"Who says Noah did not know anything you are claiming that he did not know? Back that up."<br /><br />If Noah knew such amazing stuff,why didnt he pass such knowledge on Marcus ....Think about it<br /><br />Why let such amazing knowledge slip aside ....Knowledge that we are still only just learning about today.<br /><br />It just dont make sense Marcus ...Well not to somebody like me anyway.<br /><br />To you as somebody so well educated! with such squeaky clean grammer!,it might somehow seem awesome and really smart ...To forget to pass this type of amazing information on<br /><br />But to a uneducated person lacking in good grammer,like me<br /><br />It really seems....well a little kinda stupid!?<br /><br />What type of real wally womble! would know this great stuff,but yet not bother sharing it, and nor try to pass it on?<br /><br />Was Noah lacking greatly in common sense and good reason?,or something <br /><br /><b>Do you have any idea of how much ancient knowledge has been lost! Do you realize that we still don't really know how the great pyramids in Egypt were built? And then there's that working 2000 year-old battery in Iraq...we don't know who made it, what it was for...or why. Do you know what knowledge was lost when the library at Alexandria was burned to the ground centuries ago? I don't no one does either. All that knowledge....gone. Noah doesn't seem the ignorant one at all.</b><br /><br /><b>Understand that all people who claim to be "Chrsitains" will be going to heaven...but all atheists will be going to hell. And if you want to go there thewn you don't know what it is. You alos make a lot of assertions trying to poke holes in the design of the ark and just succeed in further embarassing yourself. Do you know how to find the Volume of a box? Do You know to convert a cubit to feet or to meters? Do you know anything about building a boat? Do you know how much space and elephant need to live? i have a better question, how did Noah convince all those animals to board the boat? Simple...they were led by God just like Noah was. how did Noah feed them? They had enough food on the ark for all the Animals. Noah was commanded to put up enough food. I'm asserting that the writer of Genesis was Moses and he knew of the size of Noah's ark because God told him. Even if you rject my answer the writer(s) of Genesis knew no one else seems to know until modern times.</b>mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-80163664928957715432010-04-05T16:22:51.005-04:002010-04-05T16:22:51.005-04:00Gandalf said
M....."it seems that you are sa...<b>Gandalf said</b><br /><br />M....."it seems that you are saying that the laws of the Bible are anachronistic and don't make sense. "<br /><br />No im saying laws surrounding faith are long over due for a big overhaul.Im saying if laws with regards to consuming alcohol and driving hadnt changed since 500 years,you would be one of those demanding some more more modern regulation.<br /><br />Im saying you like many ignorant faithful folk display double standards,because while you like poking your nose into laws of regulation about many other matters .Such as gay marriage or abortion etc...You try telling us faith regulations made 500 years ago, might still be good enough for regulation of faith today.<br /><br />Its obvious you are very wrong and ignorant about this,because the fact that many abusive christian groups can still form and are still able to exist and cause harm....Like johnstown for one instance.<br /><br />Is proof sure enough, more regulation must surely be needed and is in fact long overdue.And until that happens,faith freedom is like a smoking gun!, ever ready and waiting for another abusive cult/sect leader to reload and fire .<br /><br />If your 500 year old regulation was good enough,how the hell was it able that suicide cults/sects can exist?.<br /><br />And it didnt just happen overnight Marcus ....Even the johnstown problem was long forseen as likely!, by many ...But old 500 year old bullshit crap regulations ....Meant nothing could be done about it<br /><br />Faith is still mostly unregulated.<br /><br />And i think thats very wrong. <br /><br /><b>You still never said what you are so upset about. What needs to be changed? Jonestown is not a good example becaue they expressly and completley went against scripture and you will not find a person who agree with the doctrines and theology. If you re argument is that such sects and and groups need to be stopped I agreee. And when they come to the attentions of the public they are. When it comes to my attention, I'd be more than happy to stop them. Inm order for your anger against all Christians to be justified you have to show trhat such abuses and crimes are a part of the Bible ands you can't. If I'm ignorant about something it's your point because you are not making any coherrent sense...just raw emotion without any context or proof.</b>mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-69262378747152706902010-04-05T16:22:51.006-04:002010-04-05T16:22:51.006-04:00Gandalf said...
No i dont think so Marcus.Its qui...<b>Gandalf said...</b><br /><br />No i dont think so Marcus.Its quite obvious you are very wrong,we have had scripture around a very long time....During this time much harm has still happened due to people relying on trying to use scripture.<br /><br />M...."If you think I have said anything inconsistent w/the Bible, then prove it...let's go to the text and see what the Bible really says."<br /><br />Dont be so very silly...Personally im not even interested in bothering.Go have your fun dealing with putting the multitude of people of the christian faith cults/sect who most certainly will differ on what your personal beliefs are on this subject.<br /><br />I dont need to argue with you over this matter any further.Its your problem as one of the very many christian sect/cult members !,and not my problem to sort out.<br /><br />My only job is pointing out you lot still have a problem! which still causes many problems!.<br /><br />You lot need to start getting your act together and bloody (do something) about fixing it.<br /><br />Because we are sick of your words of feeling sorry,your words are worthless and hollow ....and only serve to make ((you)) feel wonderful! and prop up your christian bullshit.<br /><br /><b>You have hit the nail on the head, The reason why there are crimes and stuff is because people are refusing to obey the commands and views given in scripture. Just as you are! I made the challenge because i see scripture as being rational and able to be understood. If we sit there and read it and consider the content we should not be able to come with widely different understandings that make the will of of God inconsistent and illogical. If that is what you are getting then you are not reading the text but making it up as you go. The "christians" whom you hate who are doing what you consider so wrong - what are they doing and do you think that Scripture says they are right?</b>mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-34679969208151580792010-04-05T16:19:55.419-04:002010-04-05T16:19:55.419-04:00@Gandalf
Marcus....."Who said I'm afrai...<b>@Gandalf</b><br /><br /><br />Marcus....."Who said I'm afraid of faith regulation. People need to be accountable for what they teach and what they do. Who said anything bigoted besides you? "learn you"?...just one word: "grammar". Who's ignorant?"<br /><br />Oh good ...So ok,now please show me what ((ACTION)) you and your faithful friends have been taking towards promotion of this faith regulation ?.Has your church congregation been in contact with the government asking for more new laws that allow for more faith regulation?<br /><br />What ACTION have you all been taking Marcus.Point me to information that proves you are taking some action.<br /><br /><b>What kind of action would satisfy you? What kind of crimes are you trying to prevent that we already don't have laws for?</b><br /><br />Ohh and you can stick your fancy grammer!,and any fancy education you might have.I personally dont feel i need it..Having fancy grammer or fancy education,still dont nessarily make anyone so very smart.<br /><br />Im sure Bush had great grammer! and a mighty fine bloody education too!....But look what a idiotic mess he`s made of matters hmmm ...Kind of f**king mighty dumb! wasnt it?<br /><br /><b>You called me ignorant but where have you been the past 8 years? Everyone who knows anything about the ex-president calls his intellect and education into question.</b><br /><br />And for all your fancy grammer and fine education,i personally dont see its actually helped you in much other than having a great ignorance.<br /><br />Im not against good grammer or good education !.......But i dont bow down to ignorant people,just because they are scholars<br /><br />Fair enough? <br /><br /><b>Not fair at all. I smell a double standard. And it stinks. Agreed and education doen't make you intelligent and a lack of education dosn't make you stupid but it does make you ignorant. You kept calling me ignorant becasuse I disagree with you not that you can illustrate my lack of knowledge in what you have accused me of being ignorant. However, you constantly show that you have little idea of many things you are talking about.</b>mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-10136375487834121962010-04-05T09:41:08.488-04:002010-04-05T09:41:08.488-04:00Suggested Ark length 450ft
http://ldolphin.org/ci...Suggested Ark length 450ft<br /><br />http://ldolphin.org/cisflood.html<br /><br />..................<br /><br />Taken from ...Largest ((known)) wooden ships<br /><br />104 m<br />(341 ft) 20.3 m<br />(66 ft) Caligula's Giant Ship ca. 37 foundation of lighthouse Traces of this Roman barge were found during the construction of Rome's Leonardo da Vinci International Airport in Fiumicino, Italy. Some speculate that this ship, or a similar ship, was used to transport the obelisk in St. Peter's Square from Egypt on the orders of Roman emperor Caligula.[25] <br /><br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world%27s_largest_wooden_ships<br /><br />.............................<br /><br />And yep its a "barge" type<br /><br /><br /><br />Marcus what decent proof do you really have that folks who wrote bibles,could have never known any idea how to go about building a type of large barge?.Gandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-45240047484895588822010-04-05T09:19:43.378-04:002010-04-05T09:19:43.378-04:00Quote off Marcuses proof..."A. It is given in...Quote off Marcuses proof..."A. It is given in cubits as being 300 cubits long by 50 cubits wide and 30 cubits high. A cubit in the OT was generally about 17.5 inches. However, an Egyptian royal cubit measured about 20.5 inches. Since Moses was educated in Egypt we must allow for the possibility that the longer measurement was meant here. The Ark, therefore, could have measured from 437 feet to 512 feet in length! It was not until the late 19th century that a ship anywhere near this size was built. <br /><br />B. It's Ratio <br /><br />The Ark had a ratio (length x width x height) of 30 x 5 x 3. According to ship-builders, this ratio represents an advanced knowledge of ship-building since it is the optimum design for stability in rough seas. The Ark, as designed by God, was virtually impossible to capsize! It would have to have been tilted over 90 degrees in order to capsize. <br /><br />C. Its Volume. <br /><br />With the shorter cubit the Ark would have an internal volume of 1,518,750 cubic feet, or the equivalent of 569 standard railroad boxcars. If the average sized animal was the size of a sheep it means the Ark could hold over 125,000 sheep. (Assuming the shape of the Ark to be rectangular there would have been over 100,000 sq. ft of floor space!)"<br /><br />........................... <br /><br />Personally i think maybe some of these calculations sound a little hopeful? .<br /><br />But anyway putting that aside ...considder that (just one) elephant could consume maybe 100-200kgs of food per day and plus also drink 100-250litres of water ...Plus would also need enough room to move and have some exercise,or all manner sicknesses and especially trauma`s! would soon set in !.<br /><br />People who understand animal health , understand animals will start to die off !! rather quickly when distressed and/or unhappy ...still even today! <br /><br />Thats just how they are .<br /><br />Even if the Ark were "the equivalent of 569 standard railroad boxcars"<br /><br />By the time you considder everything needed ,for survival of so many ...It just isnt going to pan out so very great is it<br /><br />No its maybe a great early novel story.<br /><br />But honestly, it can be seen as little more than that really.Gandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-13166067994664814912010-04-05T08:44:50.616-04:002010-04-05T08:44:50.616-04:00Marcus said...."I'm just agreeing with it...Marcus said...."I'm just agreeing with it because there is evidence that the Bible is true and none that it is false."<br /><br />Well if there is some place called hell and christians will be in heaven.<br /><br />Im personally quite happy to end up in this hell ...Because if i end up where all the christians are that offered up worthless hollow words of "sorry" for faith abuse experienced by far to many! ....I`ll only end up feeling bloody very angry<br /><br />And want to bash the "hell" outa them.<br /><br />So im fine with where ever i go,just so long as its not like ground hog day ...And full of faithful thoughtless folks,once again<br /><br />..............<br /><br />The links you posted state its about "FACTS ON NOAH'S ARK" <br /><br />Yet states ...."A. The Designer was God Himself. We do not need to assume Noah knew anything about ship-building. The instructions for design are given in Gen. 6:14ff. "<br /><br />Then yet later on states....what "gopher wood" actually is,is actually unknown.<br /><br />Talks about matters of conclusions,which realistically honestly ammount little more than merely assuming what tends to suit.<br /><br />Says stuff like..."From the story in the Bible, it also would appear that Noah had no control over the vessel. He, and it contents were at the total mercy of God."<br /><br />Yet we know what actually happens! to most idiots without control of their boats, relying on the total mercy of god at sea even today.They tend to often sink!<br /><br />Talks about..."18 inch space at the top that is open all around the vessel. This then would be for ventilation, and when water entered it would drain out somewhere below, similar to the vents in cars."<br /><br />Ohhh sure... this wee 18inch space would allow the stench to escape enough, before causing death through build up of fumes etc ...Even though modern ocean liners with far more modern ventalation systems still sometimes have these problems that cause animal loss.<br /><br />And does this bible explain to old Noah, how to keep water from entering this vent...Strange seems.. no.<br /><br />Says....""pitch" is obscure. It was more likely some resinous material used not only to waterproof the vessel but also to prevent decay"<br /><br />Funny they didnt think to record the recipe ...We might have had some good uses for this "pitch" that was magic and treated timber so well it was sure to last 100pluse years and still keep the boat timber stable enough to handle very flooded seas.<br /><br />Did Noahs wisdom suggest,maybe it wasnt something that might be useful for his offspring and their future offspring to know??.<br /><br />The measurements given for this Ark are not particualy huge,considdering what it was expected to hold ...enough animals plus replacements plus enough stores of food.<br /><br />Making this Ark not really so very large or roomy....I mean what with room for animal exercise and stuff?<br /><br />Pfffttttt!! ....Its obviously a early novel story,written by people who had obviously already learned somethings about boats.<br /><br />Claims stuff like...."B. It's Ratio <br /><br />The Ark had a ratio (length x width x height) of 30 x 5 x 3. According to ship-builders, this ratio represents an advanced knowledge of ship-building since it is the optimum design for stability in rough seas."<br /><br />Yet where is the proof that any ship builders actually say this ???.Surely if its honest,they would have been quick to provide the proof being that it was honest and available ..right?<br /><br />Marcus i think ive already seen enough ...If this is what you considder good proof.<br /><br />I have to say personally i still dont find it so very convincing....If anything it makes it look even more! to quite likely be merely a early novel story written by ancient man.Gandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-47058398802075030852010-04-05T07:41:47.977-04:002010-04-05T07:41:47.977-04:00Marcus said......"Who says Noah did not know ...Marcus said......"Who says Noah did not know anything you are claiming that he did not know? Back that up."<br /><br />If Noah knew such amazing stuff,why didnt he pass such knowledge on Marcus ....Think about it<br /><br />Why let such amazing knowledge slip aside ....Knowledge that we are still only just learning about today.<br /><br />It just dont make sense Marcus ...Well not to somebody like me anyway.<br /><br />To you as somebody so well educated! with such squeaky clean grammer!,it might somehow seem awesome and really smart ...To forget to pass this type of amazing information on<br /><br />But to a uneducated person lacking in good grammer,like me<br /><br />It really seems....well a little kinda stupid!?<br /><br />What type of real wally womble! would know this great stuff,but yet not bother sharing it, and nor try to pass it on?<br /><br />Was Noah lacking greatly in common sense and good reason?,or somethingGandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-14718574205062619052010-04-05T07:27:21.632-04:002010-04-05T07:27:21.632-04:00Marcus....."Who said I'm afraid of faith ...Marcus....."Who said I'm afraid of faith regulation. People need to be accountable for what they teach and what they do. Who said anything bigoted besides you? "learn you"?...just one word: "grammar". Who's ignorant?"<br /><br />Oh good ...So ok,now please show me what ((ACTION)) you and your faithful friends have been taking towards promotion of this faith regulation ?.Has your church congregation been in contact with the government asking for more new laws that allow for more faith regulation?<br /><br />What ACTION have you all been taking Marcus.Point me to information that proves you are taking some action.<br /><br />...................<br /><br />Ohh and you can stick your fancy grammer!,and any fancy education you might have.I personally dont feel i need it..Having fancy grammer or fancy education,still dont nessarily make anyone so very smart.<br /><br />Im sure Bush had great grammer! and a mighty fine bloody education too!....But look what a idiotic mess he`s made of matters hmmm ...Kind of f**king mighty dumb! wasnt it? <br /><br />And for all your fancy grammer and fine education,i personally dont see its actually helped you in much other than having a great ignorance.<br /><br />Im not against good grammer or good education !.......But i dont bow down to ignorant people,just because they are scholars<br /><br />Fair enough?Gandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-90412986120720657142010-04-05T07:07:57.537-04:002010-04-05T07:07:57.537-04:00Marcus McElhaney said..."The Reformation is e...Marcus McElhaney said..."The Reformation is enough because scripture is enough to determine faith and practice"<br /><br />No i dont think so Marcus.Its quite obvious you are very wrong,we have had scripture around a very long time....During this time much harm has still happened due to people relying on trying to use scripture. <br /><br />M...."If you think I have said anything inconsistent w/the Bible, then prove it...let's go to the text and see what the Bible really says."<br /><br />Dont be so very silly...Personally im not even interested in bothering.Go have your fun dealing with putting the multitude of people of the christian faith cults/sect who most certainly will differ on what your personal beliefs are on this subject.<br /><br />I dont need to argue with you over this matter any further.Its your problem as one of the very many christian sect/cult members !,and not my problem to sort out.<br /><br />My only job is pointing out you lot still have a problem! which still causes many problems!.<br /><br />You lot need to start getting your act together and bloody (do something) about fixing it.<br /><br />Because we are sick of your words of feeling sorry,your words are worthless and hollow ....and only serve to make ((you)) feel wonderful! and prop up your christian bullshit.<br /><br />M....."it seems that you are saying that the laws of the Bible are anachronistic and don't make sense. "<br /><br />No im saying laws surrounding faith are long over due for a big overhaul.Im saying if laws with regards to consuming alcohol and driving hadnt changed since 500 years,you would be one of those demanding some more more modern regulation.<br /><br />Im saying you like many ignorant faithful folk display double standards,because while you like poking your nose into laws of regulation about many other matters .Such as gay marriage or abortion etc...You try telling us faith regulations made 500 years ago, might still be good enough for regulation of faith today.<br /><br />Its obvious you are very wrong and ignorant about this,because the fact that many abusive christian groups can still form and are still able to exist and cause harm....Like johnstown for one instance.<br /><br />Is proof sure enough, more regulation must surely be needed and is in fact long overdue.And until that happens,faith freedom is like a smoking gun!, ever ready and waiting for another abusive cult/sect leader to reload and fire .<br /><br />If your 500 year old regulation was good enough,how the hell was it able that suicide cults/sects can exist?.<br /><br />And it didnt just happen overnight Marcus ....Even the johnstown problem was long forseen as likely!, by many ...But old 500 year old bullshit crap regulations ....Meant nothing could be done about it<br /><br />Faith is still mostly unregulated.<br /><br />And i think thats very wrong.Gandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-73588861540636755422010-04-04T01:31:56.137-04:002010-04-04T01:31:56.137-04:00Gandalf
Marcus said .."I never said anything...<b>Gandalf</b><br /><br />Marcus said .."I never said anything about macro evolution. All of my examples referred to micro evolution - evolution within species. I disagree that Noah had to save every species of wolf or domesticated Dog. No. Just the common ancestor. When you count life like that, it's not nearly as many animals as you and shane think."<br /><br />Even if what you say is correct,still the change that would have had to have taken place would have had to have been tremendous ...So why then didnt we know much about evolution until the likes of Darwin?.<br />And besides even just the common ancestor would have been huge enough!,and considering we (now know today) many things can only survive healthily on eating very fresh foods....Noah not knowing this would have needed to take on many many more replacements,that wouldnt have been able to survive any better either.<br /><br />No Marcus its only a story.A story written by people of old who were obviously still very uneducated about many things ....Isnt it funny how being uneducated about certain things,can later show things up as being fibs!<br /><br /><b>Who says Noah did not know anything you are claiming that he did not know? Back that up.</b><br /><br />M said..." don't think you followed my argument.I pointed out that proportion is only used for large ships, not small ones. And it's only been a couple of hundred years that modern ship building has been using the proportion. Again how did the writer of Genesis know even if you believe the story did not happen?"<br /><br />Prove it.Show me the data that proves its only been used a couple of hundren years.And only for large ships not small ones etc.<br /><br /><b>Not a problem. <a href="http://ldolphin.org/cisflood.html" rel="nofollow">FACTS ON NOAH'S ARK </a> and <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world%27s_largest_wooden_ships" rel="nofollow">List of world's largest wooden ships</a> we know that the largest wooden ship on that other list don't date anyhere near Noah's ark or anywhere near its size. The other ships from ancient times show that the knowledge to make larger ships possible until modern times.</b><br /><br />Marcus said ..."Even if all atheists go to hell (and you will) there will be more religious people in hell than atheists."<br /><br />Oh Marcus you made the postive claim so first please prove there is actually a place called hell....Then prove im going to hell<br /><br />Until you do this your words are just rubbish and sad threats from some hollow person calling himself a christian who tells me he`s supposedly sorry i personally experienced abusive faith ...in effect handing out mere worthless words that only really serve to make himself feel so wonderful<br /><br /><b>I was making an argument to show that it doesn't make sense to say that hypocrites mean that Christianity is false. You seem angry that I was just pointing out what the Bible says. MY main claim was not that hell is real, but that there will be more religious people in hell than atheists. The best proof that I have for the existence of hell and who goes to hell is what the Bible says. I'm just agreeing with it because there is evidence that the Bible is true and none that it is false.</b>mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-66129225495368143402010-04-04T01:31:56.138-04:002010-04-04T01:31:56.138-04:00@Gandolf
What a feeble excuse ...a reformation th...<b>@Gandolf</b><br /><br />What a feeble excuse ...a reformation that happened 500 years, ago you feel is enough??<br /><br /><b>The Reformation is enough because scripture is enough to determine faith and practice </b><br /><br />And then you blame/acuse other faithful folks of faith for supposedly taking their own slants and/or ignoring the bible etc ..just as those folks! would also maybe suggest about you!.<br /><br /><b>If you think I have said anything inconsistent w/the Bible, then prove it...let's go to the text and see what the Bible really says.</b><br /><br />How ignorant of you Marcus.<br /><br /><b>Let's just see who is ignorant here.</b><br /><br />And if it was about road speed we were discussing here, would you be suggesting maybe road speeds set in times of old of horse and cart was still quite fine and dandy today?.Or levels people drank before driving that was once thought ok and allowable back in the 1950s should be seen as still fine and dandy today?.<br /><br />Or with these matters that didnt happen to be about rights of faith freedoms, would you display double standards! and be out there actioning with all your other supposedly caring faithful friends,to make sure some new regulations were made?.<br /><br /><b>it seems that you are saying that the laws of the Bible are anachronistic and don't make sense. Kind of dumb. Do you really see a time when stealing or lying is going to be appropriate as a rule? What laws are you are you referring to that are anachronistic? I am not saying to anyone that the ceremonial laws should be applied today.</b><br /><br />Why be so afraid of more faith regulation Marcus? ...Look just admit it you are just another ignorant bigoted faithful person with double standards ...offering people like me who experienced abusive faith ...only your worthless bullshit words of ...oh im sorry to hear you experienced it that way...blah blah bullshit bullshit<br /><br />While turning a blind eye to taking any real ACTION to help make sure it stops<br /><br />Im not interested in your bullshit hollow worthless words, of supposedly how sorry you are.<br /><br />Didnt anybody learn you! ...action! always speaks much much louder than mere worthless words<br /><br /><b>Who said I'm afraid of faith regulation. People need to be accountable for what they teach and what they do. Who said anything bigoted besides you? "learn you"?...just one word: "grammar". Who's ignorant?</b>mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-6613894207329276322010-04-03T10:45:27.755-04:002010-04-03T10:45:27.755-04:00Marcus said .."I never said anything about ma...Marcus said .."I never said anything about macro evolution. All of my examples referred to micro evolution - evolution within species. I disagree that Noah had to save every species of wolf or domesticated Dog. No. Just the common ancestor. When you count life like that, it's not nearly as many animals as you and shane think."<br /><br />Even if what you say is correct,still the change that would have had to have taken place would have had to have been tremendous ...So why then didnt we know much about evolution until the likes of Darwin?.<br />And besides even just the common ancestor would have been huge enough!,and considering we (now know today) many things can only survive healthily on eating very fresh foods....Noah not knowing this would have needed to take on many many more replacements,that wouldnt have been able to survive any better either.<br /><br />No Marcus its only a story.A story written by people of old who were obviously still very uneducated about many things ....Isnt it funny how being uneducated about certain things,can later show things up as being fibs! <br /><br />M said..." don't think you followed my argument.I pointed out that proportion is only used for large ships, not small ones. And it's only been a couple of hundred years that modern ship building has been using the proportion. Again how did the writer of Genesis know even if you believe the story did not happen?"<br /><br />Prove it.Show me the data that proves its only been used a couple of hundren years.And only for large ships not small ones etc.<br /><br />Marcus said ..."Even if all atheists go to hell (and you will) there will be more religious people in hell than atheists."<br /><br />Oh Marcus you made the postive claim so first please prove there is actually a place called hell....Then prove im going to hell<br /><br />Until you do this your words are just rubbish and sad threats from some hollow person calling himself a christian who tells me he`s supposedly sorry i personally experienced abusive faith ...in effect handing out mere worthless words that only really serve to make himself feel so wonderfulGandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-33024680795411299512010-04-03T10:24:40.807-04:002010-04-03T10:24:40.807-04:00Marcus McElhaney said..."Thanks for clarifyin...Marcus McElhaney said..."Thanks for clarifying your position. Such regulation has already occurred 500 years ago! Ever hear of the "Reformation"? That is what it was all about. If you look at all wacky cults and differing faiths you are lamenting about they all reject one fundamental result of the Reformation. It's called "Sola Scriptura". Instead of using and following the Bible they take their own slants and ignore the Bible. Name one that doesn't."<br /><br />What a feeble excuse ...a reformation that happened 500 years, ago you feel is enough??<br /><br />And then you blame/acuse other faithful folks of faith for supposedly taking their own slants and/or ignoring the bible etc ..just as those folks! would also maybe suggest about you!.<br /><br />How ignorant of you Marcus.<br /><br />And if it was about road speed we were discussing here, would you be suggesting maybe road speeds set in times of old of horse and cart was still quite fine and dandy today?.Or levels people drank before driving that was once thought ok and allowable back in the 1950s should be seen as still fine and dandy today?.<br /><br />Or with these matters that didnt happen to be about rights of faith freedoms, would you display double standards! and be out there actioning with all your other supposedly caring faithful friends,to make sure some new regulations were made?.<br /><br />Why be so afraid of more faith regulation Marcus? ...Look just admit it you are just another ignorant bigoted faithful person with double standards ...offering people like me who experienced abusive faith ...only your worthless bullshit words of ...oh im sorry to hear you experienced it that way...blah blah bullshit bullshit<br /><br />While turning a blind eye to taking any real ACTION to help make sure it stops<br /><br />Im not interested in your bullshit hollow worthless words, of supposedly how sorry you are.<br /><br />Didnt anybody learn you! ...action! always speaks much much louder than mere worthless wordsGandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-19438596935461033072010-04-03T03:24:06.660-04:002010-04-03T03:24:06.660-04:00@Philip R Kreyche
Of Course I am referring to th...@Philip R Kreyche <br /><br />Of Course I am referring to the Bible. IF you mean that the Bible is not a single entity because it contains 66 books and therefore implying that the standards contained in them are conflicting and contradictory then I have challenge for you: Prove your claim. Prove that the 66 books for the Bible do not present a coherent and unified objective standard for morality and ethics. Either admit that it does and you reject that standard as binding on you or you have to prove that there is no standard.mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-60180249025685954402010-04-02T03:56:46.545-04:002010-04-02T03:56:46.545-04:00Marcus,
What is the standard of morality you'...Marcus,<br /><br />What is the standard of morality you're referring to? "The Bible" is not a single entity, as you well know. Are you referring to the Noahide Laws or the Mitzvot (the only two more or less objective lists of demands that are claimed to be from the Jewish god)?Philip R Kreychehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13079037983351521346noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-50419777288637581472010-03-28T23:50:03.514-04:002010-03-28T23:50:03.514-04:00@Gandalf
No i dont think you did explain anything...@Gandalf<br /><br /><i>No i dont think you did explain anything.That is unless you are trying to suggest macro evolution happened extremely fast around and after Noahs time.You would need to be suggesting many more species formed after Noah in a extremely fast manner,and also try and then explain why this extreme fast developement hadnt been recorded by anyone else.</i><br /><br />Did you follow all of my argument. Doesn't seem like. I never said anything about macro evolution. All of my examples referred to micro evolution - evolution within species. I disagree that Noah had to save every species of wolf or domesticated Dog. No. Just the common ancestor. When you count life like that, it's not nearly as many animals as you and shane think. <br /><br /><i><br />Marcus listen to Shane,like he said this story fits (fiction)thoughts of man, who`s educated enough to understand certain things,such as the general proportions needed for boats.Why?,because he used boats and already worked out which ones stayed afloat.</i><br /><br />I don't think you followed my argument.I pointed out that proportion is only used for large ships, not small ones. And it's only been a couple of hundred years that modern ship building has been using the proportion. Again how did the writer of Genesis know even if you believe the story did not happen?<br /><br /><i>Lack of religion has ABSOLUTELY NONE!, scientific evidence that it causes evil,nor has it even been proved there is any place called hell.</i><br /><br />I don't remember arguing that. Again I don't think you understand. I'm saying that we are all evil and deserve judgement if you use the standard of goodness the Bible says. You are the one who like Red herrings and straw men. Not I. You said religion was evil. I was rebutting you, not saying that. And by the way there is going to be more religious people in hell than atheists because atheists make up such a small percentage of humanity in comparision. Stated another way: Even if all atheists go to hell (and you will) there will be more religious people in hell than atheists.mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-41465425335084637542010-03-28T22:36:26.465-04:002010-03-28T22:36:26.465-04:00@Phillip R Kreyche and @Gandalf
No wonder your ex...@Phillip R Kreyche and @Gandalf<br /><br />No wonder your exegesis is so weak because your reading comprehension is tainted by arrogance and bias. I never said that I had the view of church history. When I spoke about 2000 years I was obviously referring to the 1st Century church and to Jesus not to what came afterward.mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-66615277088659526352010-03-28T22:30:09.883-04:002010-03-28T22:30:09.883-04:00@Gandalf
Thanks for clarifying your position. Suc...@Gandalf<br /><br />Thanks for clarifying your position. Such regulation has already occurred 500 years ago! Ever hear of the "Reformation"? That is what it was all about. If you look at all wacky cults and differing faiths you are lamenting about they all reject one fundamental result of the Reformation. It's called "Sola Scriptura". Instead of using and following the Bible they take their own slants and ignore the Bible. Name one that doesn't.mmcelhaneyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07567242628894011776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-89724638527603553682010-03-28T09:08:07.348-04:002010-03-28T09:08:07.348-04:00Marcus said...."What are you trying to change...Marcus said...."What are you trying to change? I see the western world becoming more and more secularized so I don't know what you are talking about. I don't want people to be like me. I want them to be like Jesus. Again I'm not sure what you are arguing for or against. You don't want building codes? You don't want traffic laws? I would like to know how come you think the Bible promotes ignorance and cruelty? What double standard? I don't think you are reading the same Bible."<br /><br />Yes im sure maybe the western world is becoming more and more secularized,i think maybe it has to.<br /><br />And no, its got nothing to do with not wanting any building codes or traffic laws etc.<br /><br />Cant you understand this is part of the double standard im actually talking about.(We do) have such things as building codes! and traffic laws! etc,but ((we dont)) really have many faith regulations!do we.<br /><br />(Which is why!!) all these very many wacky christian cults and differing faiths etc are all able to still exist,they all exist under the banner of "freedom of faith" laws that exist<br /><br />Freedom of faith laws, is more of a kind of more of a "deregulation".<br /><br />And without existence of these old rights of deregulation of faith....All the Situations like johnstowns or westbro baptist or Waco or Separatist religious shunning etc ,would not exist.And i would likely not have even needed to experience what i did!.<br /><br />The double standard im talking about is .<br /><br />Faithful like all the regulation and laws, such as traffic or building, or even quite happy to be pushing for regulation of gay marriage or abortion etc.<br /><br />But like to keep to the "deregulation" of faith?.<br /><br />(Thats a double standard).Why is faith continually thought so exempt of regulation ?,when so much else all around us we see is often regulated!.<br /><br />We expect traffic regulations! and building codes! that thankfully! do protect some of our rights to some general safety and protection!,and yet regulation of faith is still really barbaric and still willy-nilly a lot like some sort of "faith Russian Roulette"<br /><br />(Often our lives depend on) to whom! it happens you are born to, as to whether you are actually more lucky to be born Catholic, or born under the abusive Westbro batist,or into the deceit of Benny Hinn etc.Or secluded off somewhere in the Mormon or Amish ...etc etc etc<br /><br />Yes ..Regulation does protects us from danger! with traffic or building codes.<br /><br />But regulation is really almost non existent!, to protect us against DANGER of abuse of faith.<br /><br />That is a blatant double standard!<br /><br />Specially designed and voted for by faithful of old times, to make available (special sanctions) so as to have "freedom" to exercise faith, even if causing harm...ie (jonestown,mormon,westbro,Benny Hinn,etc,etc)... Without much real worry or fear of ever being really held to account !????.<br /><br /><br />Why do these double standards still exist today Marcus?.<br /><br />Im not interested in you apologizing, that i experienced the abusive faith that i did!<br /><br />I`d much prefer to hear and know why are we humans (still not) yet even afforded some decent "protection" by "regulation" of all these faiths now that its actually the year 2010!!<br /><br />Never mind feeling sorry about what i experienced ...Im far more interested in what ((REAL ACTION)) are you and all your church friends are taking?? to campaigne for "faith regulation" <br /><br />Faithful seem quite happy to campaigne for regulation of abortion or gay marriage etc etc<br /><br />So when will they stop this double standard attitude of picking on abortion and rights of gays.<br /><br />And start concentrating more on fixing (their own big mess) ...and start campaigning for "regulatation of faith"..Some real HONEST ACTION i personally thinks long overdueGandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21219785.post-51694437263600473002010-03-28T07:44:45.775-04:002010-03-28T07:44:45.775-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Gandolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02624178234332819107noreply@blogger.com