"Guys like Loftus, Oppy, Carrier, etc. are the real deal."
So says someone at Christian apologist Douglas Groothuis's Blog. The full quote is this:
Do you have plans to review John Loftus' Why I Became An Atheist? Or Loftus and Richard Carrier's The Christian Delusion
? Two reasons to inspire your potential reviews of their books:
1.) They are inspiring many deconversions (check Loftus' blog for the deconversion testimonials).
2.) They are equipping and encouraging these deconverts with better intellectual tools to combat Christianity than any of the New Atheists.
The New Atheists are the strawmen.
Guys like Loftus, Oppy, Carrier, etc. are the real deal.
Will guys like Loftus reach the masses a la Dawkins? In one sense, no. In one sense, yes.
No in the sense that he probably will never sell as many books as Dawkins. In another sense, he might. His arguments and tools will provide a stronger fleet of counter-apologists to Christianity. The thoughtful deconvert is what will ultimately trouble Christianity. Loftus and his boys are grooming such unbelievers. Through their everyday conversations such ideas can be transmitted through the culture and evolve in due time. Hence the reason to address them at some point versus the New crowd.
Link.
7 comments:
Is that Groothius serious? He's advocating an argument for atheism that talks of a broken sensus divinititus? How does he know it's broken? Can it be observed, examined, weighed, or tested? I read that stuff and wonder how I ever was a believer. It comes off as a bunch of star trek geeks speaking Klingon.
There was an interesting comment by a Sarah Schoonmaker on that thread. She said she took the outsider's test of faith and lost her faith temporarily and then regained it.
So Groothius takes the 'ole reformed approach to the guy who said he lost his faith due to the OTF by suggesting he never authentically had it to begin with.
I suppose some atheists might be tempted to say the parallel thing to the Christian who said they actually did take the OTF. "well, if you passed it, you never really did consider an authentic outsider's test".
But I'm tempted to say it to. There is no such thing as an outsider through and through. After all, I run into atheist after atheist who still thinks in terms of thought patterns that they operated with as Christians.
Yeah Rob I noticed the old reformed spanking too. It must be nice for guys like Groothius to ameliorate doubt with a simple black and white response. That kind of thinking seems to secure one's control but doesn't offer much humility.
Morrison, it seems very unlikely that the guy who is "The Groothius factor" is really John.
To me it seems like you don't like what is written, so out of desperation you are doing anything to damage the credibility of the person who wrote it.
For Morrison to stalk me every single day like he does must be a heavy burden on him.
Morrison listen to me when I tell you that...
"I've come so that your yoke is easy and your burden is light." --John W. Loftus
. . . I run into atheist after atheist who still thinks in terms of thought patterns that they operated with as Christians....
Pardon my simplicity, Rob R, but what does that mean? What's a thought pattern and how do you identify a specifically Christian thought pattern?
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